Power amp section, DTS and Dolby ES decoding, remote, connectivity. Upgradeable via RS232 port for DTS Descrete ???

No built in 7.1 amp for native support for DTS descrete. Manual confusing on learning feature for remote

After my Kenwood 2090's DSP and digital section went south and after waiting over 2 months for warranteed repairs which still not done because parts are backed order by Kenwood 8(. I went out to purchase another AV receiver. Missed my movies over the Xmas 8). The usual "mid priced" suspects were rounded up, Yamaha, Sony, Denon, Onkyo, and Marantz

Was set to buy the Marantz 8000, but drop in to a an old associates new store to see what he carried. I knew he had the Denon and Onkyo lines plus Sony and Yamaha lines. I was really intrested to hear the new Denon 3801. He knew that I use to be into "highend" gear, he steared me to the Integra line of receivers right off. Liked the Integra DTR9.1/Onkyo 989 but not really justified in spending that much on an AV setup yet. I reco the Integra name from the the Onkyo Grand Integra Amps in the past and was willing to give the lower model Integra DTR7.1 a try. Man lucky I did. The DTR7.1 is one good receiver. At first it sound a little bright but after over 48hrs burn in it has smooth out. I am currently not using it to drive my mains, but using the pre out to drive a Classe power amp (I tested it driving my main speakers with the internal amp, good but better with the Classe). All other speakers are driven by the built in amps in the DTR7.1.

Where this unit really shines is how every setting can be customized. You can select any component attached and assign any audio connection to it, be it digital or analog. The only limit is the number of inputs on the DTR7.1 (2 coaxal and 2 optical, wish it it had more then 2 coaxal). It has component video switching, 2 in and 1 out. You can customize every effect (DSP, DTS, Dolby etc) setting seperately so one setting does not interfere with others. Also an Onkyo/Integra feature, Intellivolume (?) allows you to set the volume for each input source so the output sound volume is the balance fron one source to another, very nice. FM is a little weak compared to my Dynalab tuner. So far havent had unit long enough to see how it will hold out. So far its met evry expectations except it doesnt have DTS Descrete built in. The DTR7.1 has 7.1 input and 7.1 pre outs. With 7.1 pre outs it can support 2 rear back speakers required for DTS Descrete (If upgradeable via the RS232 port) but you'll need an additional amp to do it. It is THX Select cert. if thats of any importance to you. Remote is a nice back lit one. Only prob is the manual is confusing on how to get it to learn, but once figured out its simple to do.

The following is the reason why I didnt choose the others tested, all IMO stuff.

Marantz 19, very nice, expensive even on sale, not much different in sound as compared to 8000. 8000 much better buy.

Marantz 7000, nice remote, 8000 sound smoother.

Marantz 8000, close second to DTR7.1, great sounding in stero mode. But didnt seem to have the power that the DTR7.1 had when pushed really hard to really rediculous levels. No DTS ES or Dolby ES. Only 5.1 amp section. Nice remote, more power full then the DTR7.1's remote but also more complicated. Not THX cert. if it mattered. If I didnt get the DTR7.1 I would have gotten this one.

Denon 3801, nice features but how the hell does Denon measure its power ratings. Felt strained most of the time at high volume levels, thin, no bass. Just didnt have the well built heft of the Marantz or Integra units. For the same price as the DTR7.1 get the Integra.

Denon 4800, my 3rd choice. Also on sale, but lacking upgrade path for future updates kind of nixed it with me. It has ES decoding but will it do DTS descrete? Seem a lot stonger sounding then the 3300 or 3801. Bass was still kind of on the shy side as compared to the Marantz or Intregra units. THX cert. Prob Denon will discountue it to be replace by the next 4000x series.

Listen to Onkyo units also but except for the 989 lacked and upgrade option (no RS232 port). Also the integra suppositly uses better parts and larger transformer. Lacked detachable power cord which the Integra's have.

Current Setup (sound side)

Integra DTR7.1 with power cord from Classe Audio

Mirage M3 bipoles (mains) biwired with 2 sets of extremely expensive cables ($3000CDN and $1500CDN)from Distintive Tech which are no longer in business.

Classe DR-9 power amp with power cord from Distintive Tech driving M3's

Mirage C3 center driven by DTR7.1

Definitive Tech BP6 bipole surround speakers thru DTR7.1

PSB monitor back rear surround via DTR7.1 (will replace with either Mirage ore Def Tech bipoles)

2 Mirage 8in subs

Definitive Tech 15 in sub for the really low stuff

Sources:

Toshiba 2108 DVD

Pioneer 3080 LD

Kenwood 200 mega CD changer

2 S-VHS decks (JVC and Panasonic)

1 Sony Super Beta deck (yeah still have a Beta deck)

Nakamichi (sp?) 300 cassette deck (rarely used)

Maplenole (sp?) air bearing turntable with airbearing arm and Carnegie and Koetsu (sp?) MC's and using a Classe Audio DR-6 pre as stepup transformer for the MC's

Soon to get the new, yet to be release Sony 43in rear proj HD TV with the built in anamorthic support (like XBR's) for DVD's and HD TV. 43 incher because limited by space constaints.

BTW, the Kenwood Stage 3 2090 receiver didnt sound bad, it drove my M3's for 2 years before the digital processor died if you can just get over the idea that Kenwood could make some decent products you should give their products a try. The only prob here is that nobody carries the higher end Kenwood stuff anymore since the local store that use to went under (killed by the big chains).

Go a really good deal on the Integra DTR7.1 also.

Similar Products Used:

Auditioned Marantz 19, 8000, 7000 and Denon 3801, 4800

Sound quality, DSPs (especially 5.1 "stereo"), remote, and Power!

No AM/FM switch (like I care)

The sound from the DTR-7.1, as heard through my Energy Take 5s with 8" sub, is phenomenal, especially compared to the Sony (which I really enjoyed at first). Even the Re-EQ function shows remarkable capability, when it is used. The receiver produces a crisp, clear, pure music and soundtrack output. My speakers cannot handle the full power, so I guess I'll have to upgrade to the Boston Acoustics new lineup.

The remote is a joy, and if it had a few more buttons, it would be as capable a Learning Remote as the RS-1994. I particularly like the direct access to the Input selections, and to the various DSPs: however, why they skipped the button for DD5.1 and 5.1 Stereo is beyond me.

One major strength is the ability to teach Preferences (regarding volume, DSP and EQ) to each input, and to each DSP. I've had other units that learned X number of settings, and that was it, or learned EQ parameters for the individual inputs (Sony), but this is the first, highly-specific Parameter setup I've had. Makes it a lot easier. Furthermore, you can adjust the settings on-the-fly, while watching or listening, temporarily: the settings revert to your program after power-down.

Separation is stunning between five speakers; I have yet to hook up a surround back speaker (or two, which requires an outboard amp, but only for two: a single surround-back amp is integral to the receiver). Spaciousness is full-sounding and comfortable, not un-natural or irritating, like some I've heard. Separation in 5.1 stereo mode is unbelievable... way better than ProLogic. In fact, from what I've read about ProLogic II, this must be what it sounds like!

I cannot stress how clean and pure the sound is, from all sources. I don't believe I've heard anything better. One drawback: some CDs that I thought were pristine quality now exhibit their flaws! In particular, background noise that was hidden in the mix with my Sony now shines through. Wow.

If the unit becomes upgradeable (requires three things: Integra's decision, a daughterboard upgrade, and a 9.1/989 upgrade), this unit will be the penultimate receiver. If the upgrade does not become available, expect to see me reviewing the DTR-9.1 in a few months... after I upgrade...

Similar Products Used:

Sony DB930 A/V DD5.1/DTS Receiver

None

I was going to upgrade my Reciever and then my Infiniti Crescendo speakers a bit later on down the road. After listening to a few CD's through the new reciever I'm going to keep the Crescendos. This thing sounds so good that it's making me hear things I've never heard before. And this is with regular zip cord for speaker wire! I can't wait to get my BetterCables.com cables in to really hear the difference. So I've decided to keep my existing speakers and experience them with newfound respect.

Similar Products Used:

Earlier model 414PRO Onkyo

Full of Power ! Versitile, yet simple to use. Great Remote control.

Popping sound when switching inputs

I need help figuring out 2 things:

1. How the hell can I get this DTR 7.1 to stop popping ?

2. I'm not able to get any sort of OSD. I switched the monitor output to video(factory defult is s-video), and I still can't seem to get OSD. any suggestions?

Similar Products Used:

Onkyo 787

SOUND,DOLBY DIGITAL,DTS,6.1 CAPABILITY AND JUST LOADED WITH FEATURES

LACK OF CROSSOVER ADJUSTMENTS AND SIZE OF THE REMOTE

THE 7.1 WAS A LITTLE PRICY AT THE TIME AND VERY HARD TO FIND. PLACES WOULD SELL THEM IF THEY HAD THEM BUT NO ONE DID OR EVEN ONKYOS 787.
THE SOUND OF THIS RECEIVER IS VERY CLEAN NO BUZZ OR HUM IN THE BACK GROUND.THE AMPLIFIER WITH 100 WATTS X6 HAS PLENTY OF POWER.
SURROUD SOUND MODES AMAZING DOLBY DIGITAL EX, DTS ES,TV LOGIC AND THE ALL CHANNEL STEREO WILL HAVE YOU LISTENING TO EVERY CD YOU OWN ALL OVER AGAIN. I HAVEN'T TRYED THE 6.1 OUT YET FOR LACK OF SOFEWARE. BUT DO CHECK OUT DTS CDS IN 5.1 VERY COOL YOU WILL FIND THE CDS AT WWW.DTSONLINE.COM. THE RECEIVERS SET UP AND ON SCREEN DISPLAY ARE EASY TO USE. DEFINETILY USE A SPL METER AND TAPE MEASURE TO SET YOUR SPEAKER LEVELS IT MAKES A BIG DIFFERENCE THEN TRYING TO DO IT BY EYE AND EAR. THE FEW THING I'M NOT CRAZY ABOUT ARE NO ADJUSTABLE CROSSOVER WHICH IS SET AT 100Hz IF YOU SELECT THE SMALL SPEAKER. THE REMOTE IS TOO BIG FOR ONE HAND AND REALY NOT BIG TO USE TWO. FUNCTIONS ARE GREAT IT HAS LEARNED ALL OF MY FIVE REMOTES AND WITH THE PUSH OF TWO BUTTONS IT WILL CHANGE OVER EVERTHING FOR THE MODE YOU WANT.

MY SYSTEM
INTEGRA DTR-7.1 A/V RECEIVER
SONY DVP-CX850D DVD/CD 200 DISC
PIONEER CLD-D504 LASERDISC PLAYER
JVC HR-S3800U S-VHS VCR
PHILIPS WEB TV PLUS
NEC MONITOR TV 27"
SONY PLAYSTATION
VELODYNE CT-120 SUBWOOFER ON TIPTOES CONES
VELODYNE CT-41 MAINS AND SURROUDS VELODYNE CT-42 CENTER SPEAKERS
ALL CONNECTED WITH MONSTER CABLES AND AUDIOQUEST CABLES

Similar Products Used:

PIONEER PRO LOGIC A/V RECEIVER

I cannot decide between the Integra DTR 7.1 and the DS 787, could someone post the main differences please.

Paul -

The 7.1 or 6.1 issue is not whether or not you are getting 6.1 or 7.1 channels of sound, but whether or not the 6th channel of sound is discrete. In 6.1 receivers, the 6th channel is matrixed. In 7.1 receivers, the 6th channel is discrete. The 6.1 or 7.1 delineation is not inferring that there is some "magical" 7th channel. The back 2 speakers in DTS Discrete give you the 7.1 (5.1 + the 2 channels at the rear).

The debate in question is not if you should buy the 7.1 or the 9.1. Both are great machines. The 9.1 (much more expensive) advertises to have flash memory that can be updated to decode DTS ES. The 7.1 has an RS232 Port whcih people have questioned whether or not the 7.1 is updatable. That is the mystery...not where are we going to fit the "7th channel" on the disc?

Paul, I'm glad you did your homework before making your purchase. I think you made the right choice. However, I bet you were the kid in gradeschool who did his homework, but never understood it. I guess times don't really change.

Anyway, the machine is not advertised to be upgradeable, but judging from numerous posts and threads, there is a SLIGHT possibility that this machine is. I'm not sying it is upgradeable, but it IS possible.

Paul -

The 7.1 or 6.1 issue is not whether or not you are getting 6.1 or 7.1 channels of sound, but whether or not the 6th channel of sound is discrete. In 6.1 receivers, the 6th channel is matrixed. In 7.1 receivers, the 6th channel is discrete. The 6.1 or 7.1 delineation is not inferring that there is some "magical" 7th channel. The back 2 speakers in DTS Discrete give you the 7.1 (5.1 + the 2 channels at the rear).

The debate in question is not if you should buy the 7.1 or the 9.1. Both are great machines. The 9.1 (much more expensive) advertises to have flash memory that can be updated to decode DTS ES. The 7.1 has an RS232 Port whcih people have questioned whether or not the 7.1 is updatable. That is the mystery...not where are we going to fit the "7th channel" on the disc?

Paul, I'm glad you did your homework before making your purchase. I think you made the right choice. However, I bet you were the kid in gradeschool who did his homework, but never understood it. I guess times don't really change.

Anyway, the machine is not advertised to be upgradeable, but judging from numerous posts and threads, there is a SLIGHT possibility that this machine is. I'm not sying it is upgradeable, but it IS possible.

I just purchased the DTR-7.1 and agree that this is a great machine.

Regarding the issue of upgradability. My dealer said that the 7.1 was upgradable, but it would be a hardware upgrade.

I also have a question: My unit sits in the open next to my TV -- It's not in an enclosed space. After a few hours of operation the unit can get pretty warm, but I have yet to hear the fan go on. Is the fan suppossed to be silent? Or does it only go on if the machine gets really hot? Anyway to tell if it's broken?

The only upgrade is though the RS-232 port and that's a software upgrade only.

I have to appolgize for some very small inaccuracies in my previous information about 7.1 sound... they're not biggies but still should be noted.

Both the DTR 7.1 and 9.1 have 7.1 imputs on the backs of the receiver (rather than 6.1).. but based on the info I have, weither you use a speaker setup of 6.1 with a rear center, or a 7.1 setup with two additional rears, the signal is still a MONO one. So 7.1 is nothing more than 6.1 with 2 speakers on the back rather than 1.

Most receivers like the the two top-of-the-line DTR's mentioned can not currently even decode the 6th channel information from a 6.1 DVD like Gadiator. What it does do is create a MATRIX mono rear channel from the two standard rears. This is known as MATRIX 6.1. The software update that will be available though Onkyo's website will allow these receivers to properly process a DVD with a 6th channel of separte audio and route it to the back center. This is known as DISCRETE 6.1.

Concerning the Gladiator DVD, its Dolby Digital is not 6.1 as I had inaccurately mentioned.. only the DTS is. I did some more investigating and have found no DVD's so far that offer 6.1 Dolby Digital. And, as I mentioned before, I don't know of any plans for a TRUE 7.1 DVD, or a receiver that will be capable of recognizing 7.1 channels of discrete sound and processing it. Perhaps this will be on the books for the next receiver software upgrade..whenever that might be.