I love the sound... read on below

Ease of Use/ Panal Layout/Setup Menu

Marantz 8000 receivers are excellently laid out. Attention to detail and perfection in this department seems almost anal. Setup and general use from the OSD to the front panel was a joy. There's absolutly nothing bad to say here. ****1/2

Onkyo Integra DTR 7.1 receiver's front panel design is laid out exactly the same as from Onkyos 787 model. Although the style is different, the button configuration is identical. Not quite as easy to learn or use as the Marantz, they are still quite intuitive once you spend a day getting used to the setup. The OSD on both the DTR and 787 receivers has some confusing menus but, like the front panel, is easy to use and navigate after a day or so usage. Integra would to better to continue to keep moving it's line farther away from the standard Onkyo fare. ***1/2

Winner: Marantz



2 Channel , 5+ Channel

Marantz 8000 receivers, when reproducing 2 channel stereo, create a very smooth and detailed soundstage. However, the sound seems to float like a flat wall between the two front speakers and only becomes dynamic and semi-extensive at very high amp output. Although I loved the ability to hear just about every note possible from the instruments, I didn't like the fact that the performance sounded undynamic and lifeless. Considering I really like dynamics, I was not as impressed as most other are in 2 channel.
With 5 channel performance the receiver really shines. With the effect of doubling a stereo signal into the rears, 5 channel stereo kicked out lots of power... sounding much more dynamic and lively... but of course localization was non existant (which is normal for 5 channel). ***1/2

Onkyo Integra DTR 7.1 receivers really excell at both 2 channel and 5+ channel reproduction. 2 channel sound is simply the best I have heard yet on gear at its price range and smokes the Marantz with extension, dynamics, sound stage, power. Downside? The Marantz was a touch more detailed in the Midsection which is really something wonderful I miss. The 5 channel performance is equally as good with the DTR 7.1 as with the Marantz 8000. Because I rate sound dynamics higher in my mind, I have to say the Integra gives a much more engaging and natural feel to 2 channel music that just makes me smile every time I sit down and press the power button. ****

Winner: Integra



Dolby Digital and DTS

Marantz 8000 has traits which make it the best, and worst sounding home theater receiver I've heard for DD and DTS. What troubles me the most is that this receiver has a very high sound floor that seems to interfear with most DD and some DTS movie production. Vocals and quiet passages durring medium to loud reproduction lets though enough hiss to seariously interfear with the presentation. The hiss comes from the source material... only that the Marantz has a hard time syphoning it out or toning it down.
Now that we have the bad out of the way, let's get on with the good.... DD reproduction is quite good... sound staging is excellent from all channels, very very detailed with excellent presence and dynamics. DTS is where the receiver really shines though... blowing away all of its other signal processing combined that it has.. near perfection. If you've got a big DTS collection, you'll love this receiver. There is one other small issue to discuss concerning the center channel. It can tend to sound a touch muddy and recessed. DTS does help out in this matter though... as this is mostly the fault of DD tracks. So, I loved the sound with all movies and, if it wasnt for the noise floor interfearing most of the time, I'd give it 5 stars. Because of the hiss, I give it 3.5 because of the high annoyance factor. ***1/2

The DTR 7.1 has a slightly less impactful presence with DD and DTS than the Marantz. But, what it lacks in presence, it makes up for with clarity and excellent soundstaging. I find the Marantz tries sometimes to overwhelm you with sound... which, with action movies can be a good thing... but it lacks finesses. The DTR has finess and transparency. When it comes to soundstage, I do find the rear channels to be just a touch weak compared to the Marantz. turning up the rear decibel level a few notches corrects this though.
On the DTR 7.1 I did find I liked it's handling of DD sound a bit better than that of Marantz's. The DTS was a bit better on the Marantz for capturing more details... but the DTR is no slouch either... really, all opinions were very close. But keep this in mind... If you have a fairly big DD collection of DVDs as I do, I really have to recommend the Integra here. The Marantz's shoddy handling of background his is really distracting to me when I turn the volume up. It comes from the center channel spitting at me. Everything else sounds great... it really is a shame. Because of this. and Integras very close sound and better transparency, I have to award it a higher mark and recommend it instead. ****


Praises for the DTR 7.1
-Has an awsome look that's very nicely styled
-Composite Video
-THX select sound certification
-Best 2 channel stereo which gives me thrills and chills just to listen too. Really blown away
-6.1 channels of sound
-5 channel sound is also really good... and some of the DSPs on the receiver, like TV logic, are fantastic on 2 channel Television programs
-Remote is one of the best I've had the pleasure of using
-Great soundstaging in both DD and DTS
-Excellent output from the deepest low to the highest highs... no coloration or excessive hissing from analog or sub-Digital sources.
- One of the best deals out for the both home theater and 2 channel music bar none


Beefs with the DTR 7.1
-Input bleeding from some analog sources like a VCR
- FM performance is weak... I need a Turk FM Tuner
-Amp seems to give of a slight humm. but minimal
and you won't notice it unless your receiver is below 5 on the dial
-When really cranking this receiver, the use of the remote buttons will trigger a slight popping noise from the speakers. It's very faint... but annoying none the less
- Center channel sometimes experiences a very very minor humm... a throwback to its Onkyo 787 heritage
-Remote Light could stay on longer
-front input jacks not color coded like back gold plated jacks
-S video from VCR signal dims when switching FM stations in the forground. A few seconds later the picture comes back. The S video supplied is below the quality of Marantz... use top notch cables only to help.
-Fan never seems to want to come on.. even at extream heat levels
-Center channel did seem just a touch "boxy" sounding from some DD tracks... but only a few, and it wasn't as bad as the Marantz.

Overall, I rate the DTR a 4 stars




Praises for the Marantz
-BEST styling and ease of use.. bar none.
-Build quality is even better than the Integra
-OSD is a breeze to navigate
-Receiver gives the absolute best midrange sound definition of any receiver in it's class
-S video gives a perfect image every time from any source material. Standard cables will work just fine
-FM responce was certainly above average.
-Very powerful remote


Beefs with the Marantz
-Remote seemed to cluttered and hard to hold... it was Ok, but I still liked the logical placment and ease of use of the Integras.
- The sound which has great bass presence, can also come off as muddy and slow sounding
-Receiver currently has no Composite Video
- It lacks the rear center channel for DTS ES or DD EX
equipped movies
- In its price range, this receiver is still not THX certified
-The Hiss problem from DD can be overwhelming at medium to high volumes... very distracting over vocals. TV sound also sucks.
-Using a CD player without a digital output will cause problems as the analog signal from a player will trip the receivers peak level meter constantly.
- No gold plating on the back terminals


Overall, I rate the Marantz a 3.5 stars

Similar Products Used:

Bought and returned a SR 8000 from Marantz
Below I try to go into detail as to why I returned it and bought the DTR 7.1

Build quality, display/front panel asthetics, power and sound quality, great warranty

Binding posts too close together, unit is very deep(dimension wise)

I own an AV dealership in SLC and absolutely love the entire Integra line. From the popular and robust DTR-5.1 receiver right to the top of the line DTR-9.1 THX piece. Onkyo has really impressed me with the whole line-up so far. So much so that I replaced my beloved Marantz SR-8000 in my home system with the DTR-7.1.

I want to attack the nagging question first. The DTR-7.1 is not upgradable, at least not via a download and with flash software. The generation of Motorola chip that it uses does not permit flash transfers of any kind, as does the new Motorola Symphany DSP chip in the DTR-9.1. The communications port on the back of the unit is for use with control systems like Crestron and AMX. I should know, every unit that goes into one of our systems is integrated with a Crestron touchscreen of some kind. As far as a hardware update, I would doubt it due to the high costs involved, but I could be wrong.

As for the sound, demo the piece for yourself. It has a very pronounced sound with huge dynamics and in your face realism. It is detailed and articulate sounding and is easy to listen to at high volumes, a trait most receivers seem to lack. It is not as laid back and warm sounding as some of the receivers I have owned (Marantz SR-8000), but in it's environment i.e. video source reproduction with multi channel playback it really shines. The Denon and Yamaha gear sounds dead and two demensional in comparison, especially with music and two channel material. The LFE channel is very good(96/24 DSP on it probably doesn't hurt), and the bass is tight and well controlled yet has great extension. Overall this is the piece that won me over and at $1,200.00 is a great bargain.

PS> This is the ONLY receiver I have had in my possesion that would drive the Martin Logan SL3 speaker at any litenable volume without engaging the short circuit protection due to their extremely low impeadance. It really shows what the DTR-7.1 is made of. Great work Onkyo!!!

Similar Products Used:

Yamaha RXV-995, Marantz SR-8000

Paul -

Now you are right.

7.1 only means that 7.1 speakers are being used...and 6.1 channels. I'm sure it must be some conspiracy between hardware and software manufacturers to sell more speakers. DTS Discrete (7.1) specifies that you should have 7 speakers and a sub to do the 6.1 discrete channels of sound, even though the rear 2 speakers will be producing a mono signal. If you use the logic that they do this so you won't have a localized sound anyway, why don't hardware companies just sell us one dipole for the rear? Or why do we need to go to a discrete 6th channel anyway when a matrixed 6th channel gives us a more diffuse, non-localized sound to begin with.

Makes you stop and think.

Anvil, here's is another post for you stats.

Paul and Anti-Anvil, the issue of DTS ES Matrix and Discrete is confusing. But in an early issue of Sound and Vision, Randa (sp?) explained it well. 6.1 Matrix be it Dobly (actually THX) EX or DTS ES is a mono surround rear. The source is decoded from a signal inbedded in the 2 rear surround channels. Think pro-logic and how it decodes the front 3 speakers, thats what the rears are doing in EX and ES Matrix (DTS actually licence the tech from THX for DTS ES Matrix). You can actually feed the the rear surround channles of a Digital 5.1 source into a pro-logic receiver's front channel inputs (like the CD source in)and using its pro-logic decoder to achieve the matrix output for the 3 rears by using the combination of both recievers. IE: The front 3 pro-logic channels of the pro-logic unit is now the rear 3 channels using the rear source material from the 5.1 source. DTS Discrete (This one is own by DTS) is 2 discrete source materials inbedded in the two rear channels that have the capacity to produce a stereo or two channel output as opposed to matrix which is a mono source like the center channel in pro-logic. Currently only two main stream recievers can decode DTS Discrete, both are made by Denon (5800 and 3801), that I know of, but more are coming. The Gladiator disk is true DTS Discrete, but I dont really know how much a diff it is compared to matrix sound. Some mag reviewers didnt notice much diff between the DVD and the CD sources that was encode with discrete or matrix sound that are available today, but the protential is there for the movie audio remixers and sound designers to use in the future.

I mean I dont even have the DTS 7.1 anymore but I still feel its a great buy.

OK Anvil add another post to by stats. 8)

I get Anvil's point. No more post from me on this, this is getting to be like a forum rather then a review site. We can use e-mails to talk if you want to.

Sorry about all the posts guys bye,

Blade

everything

nothing

by far the greatest receiver for the money, bar none!!! just buy it!!

Similar Products Used:

all

Amp, processor, & ability to customize.

Not 7.1, or maybe it is and we aren't sure yet.

Gotta even out Anvil's 1 * rating.

There's a lot of confusion over 7.1 and 6.1 sound, Anti-Anvil.

7.1 could mean two things to consumers, that either there are 7.1 channels of encoded audio on a DVD, and/or that your receiver is capable of 7.1 channels of amplification.

Currently there are no DVD's on the market that have 7.1 channels of sound encoded and it's doubtful that they could make sufficent space without sacraficing some image quality, etc. Only 6.1 channels of sound are currently available. No change is planned for the immedate future. Dolby's version of a rear center channel (or 6th speaker) is referred to as EX, while DTS's is called ES. Check out the Gladiator DVD currently available which has both variations on the rear center channel.

Q: So if DVD's only have 6.1 channels of sound, why are some receivers claiming they can handle 7.1?

A: Because THX's variation of 6.1 Dolby Digital takes the "MONO" rear center channel singnal from your DVD and pumps it, with full power to each speaker, to 2 additional rear speakers rather than one.

Therefore, 7.1 is just a variation of 6.1... you're just taking that 1 extra rear channel, amplifying 2 speakers in stead of 1, and sending out the identical mono signal.

The Integra DTR 7.1 has 6 amps, while the 9.1 has 7. However, they both have identical "6.1" imputs on the back! If you have a small, medium, and even some large rooms will only neeed to stick with the DTR 7.1's 6 amps. If you've got a huge room with a ton of volume to fill, then go with the DTR 9.1's 7 channels of amps so you can fill up the back areas better.

Besides, you can always send the 6th channel of sound to and additional amp to give you the same 7.1 channel matrix performace of the higher end DTR.

In either case, I prefer to stick with the Integra DTR 7.1...

As you can see, I did my homework before my purchase.. better safe than sorry I always say!

The 7.1 is upgradeable like Paul says. I also talked to the sales people and they re-comfirmed the 7.1 is upgradeable from Integra even tho the web sites leads you to think its not, like Paul said, they didnt want to promote it since it had more memory then the 9.1 (4mb vs 8mb). I dont have the 7.1 anymore but still a good buy.

UPGRADEABLE PROCESSOR - READ WHY BELOW

I'm here to dispell the confusion over the RS-232 port on the back of this receiver and it's TRUE purpose.

I've read reviews on this receiver here that say you can upgrade the processor though this port, and others have discounted that believe as a falcehood.

Now some time ago when I went to buy my 7.1, the salesmen said that not only was the unit upgradeable though it's RS port, but that it had more flash ram inside it than the flagship 9.1. This of course sounded fantastic!

However, after I had read the reviews about no upgradability, I was able to confirm that the Intrgra website said exactly the same thing. How disappointed I was.

Somewhat pissed off that my dealer would give me falce info, I went in to see him today. I told him that he was apparently mistaken... and that Integra's own website said it was NOT upgradeable. Well, I was in luck because he then told me that the Integra people where there and he went over to talk with them to find out for sure about this detail.

When he came back he stated that Integra did not want to promote the 7.1 as being an upgradable unit at this time, as they are pushing the upgrade feature heavily on the 9.1 flagship model that costs almost twice as much. If they promoted the 7.1 as having the same feature, their high-end sales might drop.

So now you know... just remember, you didn't hear it from me!

Amazing, stageing and imaging, incredible DSP for All channel stereo

few and far between

I'm going to help solve a problem that alot of you have, with input bleeding and Shot noise. Don't plug this Receiver to any Power bar with any other high wattage components on it, like big screen tv's, amps, etc...I had the same problem, there was alot of shot noise comming from the amp when i got it, every time i switched DSP or Audio signal, the speakers made a pop. Well, i thought i had a bad unit, however, i contacted the dealer, and they told me to dedicate this beast to its own outlet. I did, and the noise problem has completely dissapeared.

I posted a review when i first bought it, and now have had it for over a month now. I have to say, i love it even more. Here's a little test for ya, eiter get onto Napster, or go out to a hi-fi audio store, and get any kind of music recorded by "Sheffeild Lab" they specialize in recording high fedelity audio. Put this cd in your player, turn up the integra, and close your eyes, i swear ,you believe your right there in the room with the band, its truly amazing. The All Channel stereo dsp for music is incredible. The realism is just fascinating.

The only thing i would change on this receiver thus far, is that you wouldn't have to pluck through all the dsp's before you get to the one you want. You should be able to choose it right off from the on-screen display.

One more thing, use good cables with this thing, high grade speaker wire, RCA's and fibre optic cable, it makes a world of difference. Your stereo system is only as good as its weakest link, so don't have thousands of dollars of equipment hooked up to cables that sell for .20 cents a foot.

Similar Products Used:

Onkyo, Sony, Yamaha